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On TwitterResearch jobs in France: the black humor of 2010 is the reality of 2011
The French basic research landscape is dominated by a few nationwide institute, similar to the NIST or the NIH in the US. The largest of these is the CNRS (Centre National de la Recherche Scientific). Getting a tenured job in one of those institutes enables someone to focus on basic research rather than teaching or going in the industry. It has always been quite challenging to get such position as many people apply for very few positions, and the choice of the candidates is quite political. Each year there is a call for applications, through a impressive formal process that young researchers trying to get jobs in France end up knowing quite well.
Last year, I was visiting a research lab (INCM) and I saw in their coffee-break room the following poster (on the right), that I could clearly recognize as the official call for application for positions at CNRS.
Now this poster says ‘The CNRS recruits 3 researchers (m/w) in all fields of research‘. Of course it’s a fake poster and black humor: 3 positions nationwide in all fields of research is ridiculously low. It is however an expression of the nightmare of thousands of young researchers who are applying each year and keep hearing that the government will slash the number of state employees.
The call for the 2011 applications for research positions at INRIA, the French national computer science institute, that is another one of the big research institutions in France, is out. The page is entitled Cinq postes de chargé de recherche 2e classe sont à pourvoir (5 positions for junior researchers are available). This is not a joke, and it is striking to see the similarity between the dark humor of 2010 and the reality of 2011. To be fair INRIA is smaller than CNRS, as it covers only computer science and applications (listed as applied maths, numerical computing and simulation, algorithm and software research, networks and distributed systems, and computational modeling for life sciences). The number of applications is in hundred and not thousands, but having only 5 jobs available nationwide still feels really awkward.
A minor detail: I am trying to get a job in computational science research in France.
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Saturday, January 15th, 2011 at 11:41 am under
Bonjour,
vous avez entièrement raison, et ça fait du bien de le voir écrit.
Pour donner des infos factuelle : ça représente quand même une diminution de 70 % par rapport à l’an dernier. Je sais, ça vous fait une belle jambe, vous ne vouliez pas candidater l’an dernier, seulement cette année, mais bon, ça permet de remettre à l’échelle. Il y avait l’an dernier plus de 3 fois plus de postes que cette année.
Ensuite, la situation est à la fois moins mauvaise que vous ne le décrivez et pire.
Moins mauvaise parce que ce sont en fait 8 postes qui sont ouverts aux jeunes (5 CR2 et 3 CR1). Les postes de CR1 sont ouverts à tous ceux qui ont thèse + 3 (ce qui fait du monde) et il est vivement recommandé de candidater en CR1 dès qu’on en a la possibilité (on peut candidater CR1 et CR2, c’est pas interdit, et le dossier de candidature est gratuit).
Pire parce que 3 des 5 postes de CR2 (et 3 des 3 postes de CR1…) sont attribués géographiquement, aux centres INRIA de Lille, Bordeaux et Saclay. Si l’équipe de recherche de vos rêves est à Grenoble ou Rennes, il ne vous reste plus que 2 postes “non fléchés géographiquement”, à répartir entre 5 centres INRIA. La compétition va être rude… (et pour les 5 centres “anciens”, ça représente 5 fois moins de postes que l’an dernier).
Pour l’explication, elle est simple : le nombre de fonctionnaires ne peut plus augmenter (rigueur budégtaire, tout ça…). On ne peut ouvrir qu’un nombre de postes égal au nombre de gens qui partent à la retraite. L’INRIA étant un institut “jeune”, il n’y a que 5 personnes qui partent à la retraite cette année. En raclant les fonds de tiroir, on a pu y ajouter 3 postes. Oui, là encore, j’imagine que ça vous fait une belle jambe d’avoir l’explication officielle…
Enfin, il ne faut pas forcément idéaliser un job de chercheur dans un institut en France. Certes, c’est très beau (surtout vu de l’extérieur), mais rappelez-vous que si l’INRIA n’embauche pas, d’autres le font : universités, industrie, pays étrangers… Une étude montre par exemple que 60 % des docteurs en Informatique qui ont trouvé un job dans le privé estiment que leur travail est de la recherche.
Full disclaimer : si vous êtes (potentiellement) candidat, moi je suis membre d’au moins un des jurys de recrutement. De l’INRIA, oui (et non, je n’ai pas eu d’influence sur le nombre de postes ouverts, sinon il y en aurait eu d’avantage).
January 15th, 2011 at 4:37 pmHi Nicolas,
First of all, thank you very much for your detailed reply. I’ll answer in English so that other readers may follow, as you raise interesting and important points.
I must admit that I wrote this note with a false ingenuity, as I have applied last year (and failed ;D), and know reasonably well how the system works. The announcement of the number of positions did not come to me as a surprise either.
I hope that the post did not come out as a rant. I don’t think that it is terribly useful to complain idly about things. I made the choice three years ago to jump ships from fundamental physics to CS, and, as you emphasized, the job landscape there is very good in private companies (which was not the case, IMHO, in physics). In the INRIA team with which I collaborate we have just had a student defend and find a job in the industry immediately afterward. He is very happy with what he does.
In all the labs I have worked in (only a handful, I must admit), the one that formed to most stimulating and pleasant environment for me was an INRIA team (Parietal: http://parietal.saclay.inria.fr/). This is probably due to a mixture of a research topic that suits me well, and a young and motivating team. In wanting to get a job there, I fully know that I am behaving as a spoiled kid. I am sure that there are plenty of other great teams. But I’ll take my chance and try to get a job there this year again, even thought the odds are small (as you point out, two researchers will be recruited for Saclay).
By the way, thanks for the advice on applying as CR1. I hadn’t realized that I could, because at INSERM, which is the institute in which I am currently working, one needs to have 5 years of post-doctoral research.
PS: Vous avez tweeté “C’est bien d’avoir le point de vu des candidats”. Je dirait que de notre coté c’est bien de voir que les membres des jurys sont humains, et donc merci d’avoir commenté. Je connais suffisamment de DR des différents organismes de recherches qui siègent par moment dans les jurys pour me rendre tout à fait compte que de devoir opérer une sélection brutale n’est pas non plus une partie de plaisir (2 postes, 200 candidats, une boucherie dont je ne ferais heureusement pas parti car je candidate à Saclay).
January 15th, 2011 at 6:45 pmHi Gaël,
It’s really a pity that there are only this few posts when everyone says that research is the future of a country. I can understand Nicolas’ point of keeping the number of state posts fixed, and it just is proof of the fact that the gvt doesn’t understand where the effort has to be put so that unemployement can be lowered.
Keep faith though, you have a perspective that is unique due to your background, and I hope you’ll be hired this year
Matthieu
January 16th, 2011 at 12:30 pmEh oui..
January 26th, 2011 at 8:50 pmc’est super galère..
Les Instituts se plaignent aussi de pas pouvoir recruter comme ils veulent.. non seulement on peut difficilement y entrer mais de plus ceux qui y sont sont sans possibilité d’embaucher en parallèle à leur guise pour recruter la matière grise nécessaire.. comme si le petit Nicolas voulait se débarraser de tout ce beau monde..interdit de rêver et d’inventer.. il faut du rapide, de l’immédiat..
I’d like to correct a small factual error in my earlier comment: you can apply to a CR1 job if you’ve had two years of experience after your PhD. Not three (so it’s even more open).
And I’ll say it again: if a candidate can apply (for a CR1 job), then he should definitely apply (on top of applying for the CR2 job). It can’t hurt, it’s free (or it’s only the cost of a postage stamp), and it doubles the number of positions.
Wishing the best to all who will apply.
February 8th, 2011 at 6:11 pmSo it did work: http://www.inria.fr/institut/recrutement-metiers/offres/3-postes-de-charge-de-recherche-1re-classe/preselections
April 4th, 2011 at 1:33 pmand: http://www.inria.fr/institut/recrutement-metiers/offres/3-postes-de-charge-de-recherche-1re-classe/preselections
Hey Nicolas,
I did see that. Thanks for your support. It’s very much appreciated. I must admit I couldn’t help having a thought for the jury you sit in. It must be a really though situation. Good luck with the rest of the jury mission!
April 4th, 2011 at 9:02 pmPlouf, plouf…
http://www.inria.fr/institut/recrutement-metiers/offres/charge-recherche-1re-classe/admissibilite
http://www.inria.fr/institut/recrutement-metiers/offres/charges-recherche-2e-classe/admissibilite
Impressive, impressive. Remember it’s not definitive until the “Admission”, on June 15th (the Admission Commission can, and does, change the order, depending on the scientific priorities of the institute).
May 16th, 2011 at 12:09 pmIt’s definitely very encouraging. I do keep in mind that it is not definitive, and I am very careful not to celebrate too early. But it is clearly comforting, and even if I don’t make it through, it will give a boost to my research.
Thanks for all your support.
May 16th, 2011 at 12:24 pmWell done!
Eric
May 16th, 2011 at 12:28 pmKeep in mind, as Nicolas stressed, that it is not final, and each year there are difference between admissibility and admission. This is not an exception, unlike CNRS, and it is clearly and officially stated. These results are only a recommendation, and there is only one position available for each commission.
May 16th, 2011 at 12:35 pmCongratulations Gaël !!
June 17th, 2011 at 12:17 amhttp://www.inria.fr/institut/recrutement-metiers/offres/charge-recherche-1re-classe/admission
Yeas. This is pretty awesome. I feel very lucky, and I am very happy. Parietal (the INRIA group where I will work) is such an awesome group.
June 17th, 2011 at 7:19 am